What is a series?

What exactly is a “series”? Do Hard Time Tokens count as a series?

Because they were issued at different times without planning or coordination I would say that Hard Time Tokens aren't a series.

A series is either a set of commemoratives issued together or a longer time frame like the US states Quarters or the German Bundesländer. It can also be a set of coins/banknotes that was introduced at the same or similar time frame like banknote series of 1976 etc or the Europa series euro notes.

And I agree Hard Time Tokens sounds more like a category. But if there is no other way to easily group them and this is somehow beneficial I think using the series as a means wouldn't be the worst thing. But in the end I care zero about anything exonumia so what happens with it is of no consequence to me so take my opinion as it is.

What about adding Hard Time Tokens as a subcategory of Coins > Emergency coinage > Merchant tokens?

Xavier

What about adding Hard Time Tokens as a subcategory of Coins > Emergency coinage > Merchant tokens?

I asked this question before I saw the other thread on changes to the catalog categories. So what you are suggestion almost works. Most of the Hard Times Tokens are Merchant tokens, a good portion are also Political Tokens and a handful are private coinage. Honestly, I think they need their own category just like the German Notgeld.

Could you please clarify what you mean with the German notgeld category? Are you referring to the group of issuers? If so, how would that apply to hard time tokens? The issuers in this group are local administrations, whereas hard time tokens are mostly  privately issued as far as I know.

Ben-jamin

[…] I think they need their own category just like the German Notgeld.

A clarification: Notgeld is a particular type of emergency money, issued in Germany and Austria after the First World War. Right?

Then, notgeld will be included in the new categories of https://en.numista.com/forum/topic144308.html

1.6. Emergency coinage
4.5. Emergency banknotes

Ben-jamin

What exactly is a “series”? Do Hard Time Tokens count as a series?

Reviving this post as lately there seems to be some discussion about what exactly constitutes a series.

The guidelines are not very clear on the definition:

Series – Numista

We can all agree on series as a bunch of items issued in coordination, mostly by the same issuer and often in the same year, but sometimes span over several years and even coordinated between different issues (eg. common issue €2 coins).

The problem starts when series are created based on a common theme, even though there is no coordination between the different issues. Recent discussion, where different referees take on different points:

Série Présidence du Conseil de l'UE [solved] – Numista / Delete series Presidency of the Council of the European Union and similars – Numista
Fusion Série Le Seigneur des Anneaux [solved] – Numista

This is a good example of a series based on a recurrent theme, but within the issuer:

Série Faucon pèlerin [solved] – Numista

An in this case items were removed from multi-issuer series to create separate series:
Remove issuers from series UNESCO World Heritage [solved] – Numista: split info (among others)  Dutch World Heritage – Numista versus UNESCO World Heritage – Numista

So sometimes series are merged and some are split, which makes us move in both directions at once. Clear guidelines are needed. Also take into account only one series can be used, so if an item is added to a series within an issuer it cannot be too added to a multinational "theme-series".

To me the series option is being misused to make theme-based collections. A solution would be to be more active creating tags, as it is very difficult for the moment to get new tag suggestions approved …
 

tagging @Xavier @Jarcek @tdziemia who have been active on the series requests, to please clarify!

BramVB

To me the series option is being misused to make theme-based collections. 

Completely agreed. Series share a common theme but also share a similar design. I see too many series with coins only sharing the theme but have nothing at all in common besides that.

Example: https://en.numista.com/catalogue/index.php?r=&st=1-2-3-47-155-156&cat=y&im1=&im2=&ru=&ie=&no=&v=&cu=&a=&dg=&i=&b=&m=&f=&t=&t2=&w=&mt=&u=&se=3933&c=&wi=&sw=

The coins in the shape of an owl and a hat can form a series on their own (the same particular shape and the same “lightning bolt” on the obverse)  but they have nothing in common with the other coins of this series accept the theme.

The same for this one: N#352731, that certainly doesn't belong in that series.

BramVB

Clear guidelines are needed.

+10000000

From the beginning, the Series feature was also meant to cover common designs that spread across issuers, like the Florentine florin, the Venetian grosso matapan, the Edwardian penny, the Dutch lion daalder and so on.

So, series can definitely span different issuers, or exist within just one issuer.

I agree there is room for clarification between, say, when a Series is appropriate and when Tag is appropriate.

Perhaps this “intentional” aspect would be a part of that.

tdziemia

From the beginning, the Series feature was also meant to cover common designs that spread across issuers, like the Florentine florin, the Venetian grosso matapan, the Edwardian penny, the Dutch lion daalder and so on.

I understand this use of the series in objects of the past. And I see two key words in the description: “common designs”

tdziemia

Perhaps this “intentional” aspect would be a part of that.

“Intentional”, this is the word! The series as a set of objects, with a design and subject in common, issued intentionally by an entity, is something created in the 20th and 21st centuries (I suppose there were not before, but I could be wrong).

The examples mentioned have coins with different design, and are modern coins.

BramVB

The problem starts when series are created based on a common theme, even though there is no coordination between the different issues. Recent discussion, where different referees take on different points:

Série Présidence du Conseil de l'UE [solved] – Numista / Delete series Presidency of the Council of the European Union and similars – Numista
Fusion Série Le Seigneur des Anneaux [solved] – Numista

 

An in this case items were removed from multi-issuer series to create separate series:
Remove issuers from series UNESCO World Heritage [solved] – Numista: split info (among others)  Dutch World Heritage – Numista versus UNESCO World Heritage – Numista

The definition of a series should mention both concepts:

• ancient objects with common design
• modern objects intentionally issued as part of a series

Another bad example: https://en.numista.com/catalogue/series.php?id=6496

These are two different series. They both share the same theme but that doesn't make them the same series.